David Hennessy spoke to Frances McNamee, star of the new folk musical Ballad Lines which is having its London premiere at Southwark Playhouse.
Ballad Lines, a new folk musical, is currently having its London premiere at Southwark Playhouse.
Ballad Lines, which deals with themes of identity, belonging and the stories we choose to carry with us.
The original score weaves together new songs with centuries-old traditional Scottish, Irish, and Appalachian ballads performed live, breathing new life.
The Irish World spoke to Frances McNamee, who leads the cast as Sarah, as well as Finn Anderson who is the show’s co-creator and composer/ lyricist.
In the story Sarah realises she still has a chance to be a mother.
As a queer woman living in New York City, she had long severed ties with the folk traditions of her upbringing.
But when old ballads resurface, so do the voices of her ancestors — pulling her on a life-changing journey across time.
Spanning continents and generations, Ballad Lines follows three women bound together by blood, song, and choice.
In 17th-century Scotland, Cait, a minister’s wife, wrestles with the constraints of her role.
In 18th-century Ireland, Jean, a spirited teenager, faces an uncertain future. In 21st-century New York, Sarah is caught between the life she’s built and the pull of the past.
Ballad Lines explores themes of music, tradition, motherhood and choice.
Frances McNamee plays the lead role of Sarah.
From outside Durham in England’s North East, Frances’ father is from Derry and on the other side of her family, relatives came from Monaghan.
Work has brought Frances to Ireland. In 2023 she starred in Fun Home when it had its Irish premiere at the Gate Theatre in Dublin.
She has also been in Conor McPherson’s Girl From the North Country which took her to the Olympia. She has also performed at the Bord Gáis with a touring production.
Frances’ screen credits include Casualty and Father Brown while exciting upcoming projects include Mister Seeing or From Beyond.
Frances took time to chat to The Irish World about Ballad Lines.
Are you getting powerful reactions from the audience to Ballad Lines?
“Yeah, we do.
“And it’s always lovely when someone comes up to you and says, ‘Oh, that really moved me’.
“Or, ‘That’s my story’.
“It’s obviously great if you get a standing ovation as a collective but when you hear individual people and how it’s affected them so personally, that’s really lovely.
“And they’re always like, ‘Oh, I’m sorry to bother you with this…’
“It’s like, ‘You’re not bothering me at all’.
“I love hearing that because that’s why we do it.
“It’s a bit of a ride for all of us but I’m on stage the whole time and it’s like stepping onto a train. Once you’re on, you’re on and it’s a bit of a whirlwind for me to be honest.
“But I love the challenge of it and I love that by the end of it, the audience seem like they’re really moved and they’ve been transported somewhere else.
“That’s the aim of any piece of theatre, I think.
“And actually I don’t know if it’s the world we live in right now where we all feel like these little islands a lot of the time.
“I know we’re on social media and everything and people are in touch but it’s not quite the same thing as being truly connected to other humans.
“I do think there’s something really special about being in a theatre and people feeling that way all at once.
“I think we’re craving that at the moment, to feel connected to one another and maybe that’s why this is landing as well as it is.
“It’s an amazing thing that a woman can hear about something her ancestor did and feel empowered to move through her life in a different way.
“It is a real lesson and an exploration of how we’re all linked and the decisions we make affect so many other people whether we know it or not.
“It’s a responsibility but it’s also a great feeling because you feel like you’re not alone and I think a lot of people need that right now.”
What drew you to the role?
“The music was what originally drew me to it.
“That score is just gorgeous.
“I knew that it was going to be a challenge but I suppose I didn’t really bargain for how physical it was going to be and how deep the emotional side of it would go until rehearsals if I’m honest.
“And it’s become a very different beast.
“Obviously the songs are amazing but if you couple them with the script, they just become 10 times more powerful when you put them in context.”
You speak about the emotions of it there, is it draining?
“It is but I think it’s good hard work.
“There’s a catharsis in it.
“I think most actors will tell you if they get a very satisfying arc, it feels worth it.
“Sometimes at the start of the show you’re like, ‘Oh god, how am I going to get to the end of this?’
“But once you do, it feels like such an achievement and especially if you’ve moved people and it’s been a success, it kind of feels great.
“You’re tired but I’m not going to complain about it because that’s the zenith of an actor’s experience.
“That’s what we do it for.
“It is hard work but it’s the right kind of hard work.”
In the story your character Sarah is unprepared for what she literally opens up, isn’t she?
“Yeah, she mentions in her song Secondhand Shame it’s probably something sentimental but I don’t think she could have bargained for what Betty had left behind and that legacy.
“She really underestimates the gift in the will definitely but I guess that’s kind of a universal story.
“I think we all bury our ghosts a little bit and hope that they’re not going to catch up with us but they always do in some way or another and I think that the character of Sarah and her relationship with Betty is a real exploration of that and how you can’t really be in your present and move forward into your future without confronting your past in some way and putting it to bed or accepting it.”
There is regret in the story of Sarah and her aunt Betty not reconciling before it was too late..
“Yeah, I find that really heartbreaking.
“I personally am not one to bear a grudge for that very reason, because you never know what’s around the corner and you just always hope that you’re going to be on good terms with the people that you love and who love you.
“But I understand why she doesn’t want to speak to Betty, because she doesn’t feel accepted and she doesn’t feel loved by her anymore because of the horrible things she says to her.
“It seems that Betty can’t accept a very key part of Sarah’s identity.
“I don’t really think the ball’s in Sarah’s court for the reconciliation, it is definitely in Betty’s but it’s just such a shame that she was ignoring her calls and assuming that she was never going to get an apology.
“The individual stubbornness kind of got in the way.
“That’s always the way with family members, isn’t it?
“You don’t get on often because you’re very similar.
“That’s why we butt heads and we irritate each other because the other is kind of holding a mirror up to you and the worst bits of yourself, and it’s painful.”
The other thing is Sarah opens this box and finds ancestral characters like Cait and Jean who mean so much to her. I think she may be especially drawn to them as Sarah never knew her parents..
“I think she associates the family that she knows and has grown up with with a sheltered, slightly blinkered view of the world.
“She doesn’t feel accepted by them.
“She doesn’t feel at home there and I think the ancestors she comes across in the box Cait and Jean are bits of herself.
“I think she recognises bits of herself in them that she likes: The going against the grain and being independent and forthright.
“And she aspires to that level of dignity and adventure and she really likes them in a way that I don’t think she really likes her living relatives, and that’s what gives her the courage to entertain the idea of procreating.
“She said she doesn’t want to carry on the baggage of her family line and put into the world more of their rubbish but actually she realises she’s from a very powerful, brilliant line of women and who’s to say that whoever she brings into the world won’t be like that as well?
“I think that’s a really positive shift for her to know that she belongs to a family tree of quite wonderful women.”
Although they are living in different times and different circumstances Sarah, Cait and Jean are linked through themes of motherhood and pregnancy..
“Yeah, I think the idea that Sarah has these choices before her it is kind of humbling to hear about her ancestors that just absolutely didn’t.
“One of them wants to keep her baby and nobody wants her to, is telling her that she can’t, and then the other doesn’t want a baby but she’s being told by everybody that she has to have it so it’s just completely taken out their hands.
“They don’t have autonomy over their own bodies and their own decisions in the way that Sarah does and I think she feels slightly guilty that she’s wasting that freedom which is why she opens up the conversation with her girlfriend Alix like, ‘Do we take this for granted? Are we missing a trick here? Have we really fully explored whether or not we want this?’
“I think it’s really important.
“It’s painful if you don’t want the same things as your partner, it’s a painful conversation to have but I suppose it’s better to have it sooner rather than later, then you can go your separate ways and live the life that you feel is authentic for you and what you truly want.”
Although the stories of Jean and Cait take place in other times, the themes remain very current, don’t they?
“Sadly, yes.
“If we look at the freedoms that are being slowly stripped away in America and elsewhere in the world, it’s not a million miles away in the way that it should be.
“This is 400 years ago and yet some women are going to be facing the same issues as Cait and Jean did and that’s insane to me that in certain places in the world we haven’t really come that far or if we have, we’ve retreated. We’ve gone backwards.
“We had some great conversations in the room.
“It was a very open, warm environment and we felt like we could say anything and be really honest with each other.
“I think the rehearsal room was set up for that to flourish from the very off which isn’t always the case but it certainly was on this and I couldn’t be more thrilled about that.”
Does being part of a play like this make you think of your own ancestors?
“Yeah, I’m always inspired by the tales of bravery from my family line of starting new lives in other places.
“My dad did it in the 70s.
“He left home and came over to Newcastle where he met my mam and that wasn’t in a great time.
“That was a bit of a bold move because obviously the Troubles were happening then and he came over to Newcastle and he wouldn’t always get the best reception with a Northern Irish accent.
“And I love those stories because it makes you go, ‘Well, I must have a bit of that in me as well so if they can do that, I can do this hard thing that’s ahead of me’.
“So it’s always very inspiring to hear about family members and their adventures.”
You and your brother have performed as the duo under the name Seats at Golgotha as well as other monikers.
Did you always know you wanted to follow this path?
“I can’t remember a specific moment because I can’t remember when I didn’t want to do it if I’m honest.
“I think it’s just always been a part of my life.
“I’ve always wanted to do it.
“Still it’s where I’m most at home I say and happiest.”
Is the same sex relationship in the story between Sarah and Alix another thing audiences are responding to as LGBTQ+ demographic is under represented in folk songs and tales like this?
“Yes, I think so because you’re right and we sort of touch on it in the show that Sarah doesn’t feel that there’s a place for her in these ballads because It’s all very binary gendered a lot of the time, these folk songs and they aren’t really tales that she recognises from for her own experience.
“I’m sure that’s a feeling that ripples throughout the LGBTQ+ community.
“I’m sure it is and, like I said, a lot of people do say that they feel very seen by this show and that’s really important.
“Representation is really, really important because, like I say, we all affect one another and these experiences we have, especially earlier on, can be really formative.
“If a teenager comes to see this show and they’re feeling underrepresented or misunderstood and then they see a version of themselves on stage or somebody that they can connect with and relate to, that’s really important.
“I think it’s a really powerful show for that.
“I did Fun Home at the Gate in Dublin actually and I think that was the first lesbian protagonist they’d had in a show there and if I’m honest, I didn’t know how that was going to go down but the response to that was kind of similar to the response to this.
“It just unlocks this whole other audience and it felt really, really powerful.
“And again the individual stories I heard about feeling seen by the show it was just a lovely thing to be a small part of and this show has that feeling to it.”
How did you enjoy your time at The Gate?
“I loved it.
“That was a really, really brilliant, brilliant show and I had a lovely time in Dublin.
“I’ve spent a bit of time in Dublin and great audiences in Dublin.”
Does Ireland feel like home to you?
“Yeah, it does.
“I love Dublin but I couldn’t claim to have spent a tonne of time there when I was growing up because if we went to visit my family, we would all go to the north so we’d go Donegal or we’d go to Derry or Belfast or Portrush so I spent a lot of time in the north and it’s as an adult really I’ve spent more time in the south.
“I love Ireland.
“I really do.
“It’s a great place and the people are fantastic and very warm.
“I can’t really put it into words but yes, do feel at home there.
“It’s a very particular feeling that I can’t quite articulate. But yes, I do.”
Frances concludes: “I think it’s really important that a lot of people see this.
“I think it’s a really special show and I think it deserves another outing somewhere else.
“I think more people need to see it.
“And yeah, if you feel like you are on the fence about whether or not you should take a chance on a new show, I can guarantee that you won’t be disappointed by this one.
“There will be something there for you so come and see it, because I think it’s important.
“It’s an important show and I hope it can affect as many people as possible.”
Ballad Lines is at Southwark Playhouse (Elephant) until 21 March. For more information and to book, click here.
